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Monday, October 17, 2005


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Okay, I'm sure you have all seen the PvP poll on the official forums. Quylein the Mage also ably covered the subject already. I'll just add a few comments.

One thing I've learned at work is that you never give your clients a set date for the completion of a project unless you have to. Sometimes things just take longer than you expect no matter hard you try. While SOE doesn't give an exact date, saying that a new PvP system will come "in the near future" is a mistake in my opinion. It's just setting an unnecessary and arbitrary time deadline for yourself.

And I hope they take the time to get it right. I honestly can't say if PvP is balanced right now because I haven't dueled or played in the Arena enough. But I find it hard to believe it's perfectly balanced at this point. I would rather see the new PvP go live as balanced as possible rather than see SOE introduce a system and then have to do major revamps and tweaks.

It is also difficult for people to make a choice in a poll when they have so little information to go on about how the system will work and how it will effect the usual gameplay.

The truth is that some PvP is on every server now. It's just limited to dueling and the Arena. I hope SOE doesn't consider the Arena a failed experiment on the basis of how many people are using it at this time. Sure, it seemed pretty dead the few times I have been there. But there's a reason for this. The expansion recently came out and people are busy leveling and doing quests. I bet that when more people reach 60 the Arena will become more popular.

I'd also like to remind SOE that the people who vote on a forums poll may not accurately represent the majority of the player base.

Okay, on to the issue at hand. I don't think SOE should introduce widespread PvP onto existing servers. EQII is, at heart, a PvE game, and it was billed as such. It would be unfair to bother those who prefer PvE with widespread PvP style play.

Would I like a PvP ruleset server? Of course. More options are always good and I would love to play the game in a different way. I'm not saying I would abandon my main or transfer to a PvP server. But, I can guarantee that the day the PvP Server opens, I will roll an alt there.

I don't really see any negatives. Okay, I know the one argument people will hit me with is that SOE should focus their resources on other aspects of gameplay. But that argument is unfair and could be applied to any new feature introduced to the game. Yes, SOE has to continually work on and improve the current game. If you read my Community Summit coverage you will know they are quite focused on making the new player experience better. And that's just one example. They are not going to stop fixing bugs just to introduce PvP. People are assigned to work on different aspects of the game. Adding new features is a necessity for MMO companies.

I would also like to remind people that the poll does not necessarily mean open PvP warfare in the manner people assume. I have absolutely no idea what the "new PvP system" entails. It might not be as far-ranging as we think. Perhaps there will only be PvP in certain limited zones or under certain conditions. We'll just have to wait and see on this one. Is it the near future yet?


Blogger Fraxas said...

Real Soon Now (tm) is code, in my experience, for "whenever the executives think we can't possibly wait a moment longer".

That said, I was really disappointed to see the poll, because PvP and PvE are very different beasts. Unless the monsters we fight in PvE fight similarly to the people we fight in PvP, different skills will have different strengths...and you can't balance a skill system for both.

(Outside the obvious trivial cases.)

8:37 AM  
Blogger supernoob said...

I agree with fraxas about the difficulties of getting skills right to work on both PvP and PvE. But what would be the difficulty in just having two sets of rules for each skill...A) this is what this spell does in PvE B) this is what this spell does in PvP.

I play DAoC and spells many times work differently against other players than they do against system controlled mobs.

Having said that, I agree with Aggro that they should introduce PvP into live servers but that they should come up with a PvP ruleset server. I'd probably come back quicker to the game if there was some PvP action in it and NOT just dueling. Oh, and don't just make it open PvP...some sort of goal oriented consentual PvP is much better in my opinion. Open ganking is just silly and unproductive and really has a very small fan base.

5:11 PM  
Anonymous Teh Chunt said...

I can see where the desire for open PvP comes from, given the popularity of a certain game we all may have heard of... Still, something like this could work on EVERY server. Let's think about the lore of EQ2. The world was shattered, we're rediscovering "new" areas and islands in the course of playing, and there are 2 cities at war with each other. my idea is simple. New expansion: A new continent is found by the far seas trading company, full of great wealth. The cities of Freeport and Qeynos both see opportunity, and send their citizens to settle the new land. Of course, conflict ensues as the 2 sides fight over the same areas and resources. Each side erects a few forts or cities, and groups go forth from those outposts looking for harvests, or to take more area (contested zones) from the other side.
Essentially, it would be a continent anyone could travel to, with tiered zones (2,3,4,5,6) so a L22 player would go to the 20-30 zone to battle, eventually moving up to the 30-40, etc. The continent would be a pure PvP enviroment, probably with roving mobs of faction guards. (EX-if freeport controlled zone, Dark elf guards, maybe some monsters roam around, but only good aligned peeps get aggroed from them.) Of course, the outposts would be areas of intense fighting, with one side trying to take the outposts from the other. Destructable walls would be nice (target them like on the isle of refuge, with the supply crates. Give walls a huge amount of HP, give enemy siege weapons) Every outpost could confer a small bonus upon aligned peeps across the world, or within the continent itself. (something like + to regen, 30sp per game day given to pcs, etc.) Awards like new titles and distinct looking gear given to those who are the top PvPers. Throw in a native race already on the continent trying to perserve their way of life in the wake of the great invasion (to give out quests, as well as maybe opening up a NEW player race. Gnoll, maybe?), add in new epic mobs that terrorize the countryside, (imagine having a huge PvP, then suddenly an elder dragon starts wasting people, and everyone has to zerg the thing to survive), as well as new items, pvp spells learned on the continent, and maybe a new char class (beastlord, anyone? Just rip off hunter from WoW, the feeding pet dynamic is worth stealing...), and suddenly you have WoW style PvP done in a way that makes sense in EQ2. Best of both worlds, since folks who don't like PvP won't have to be exposed to it (after all, it's confined to a whole different continent, and not necessary for enjoyment of the game), and will let folks who enjoy pvp stay on their own server with their friends, while still enjoying a zonewide PvP experience when they wanted.

3:54 PM  
Anonymous DarkElfWarden said...

PvP is in no way balaned in EQ2 right now. At least not solo PvP. I haven't really done much group PvP, but it seems to be badly balanced as well. Healers are pretty invulnerable in a group. Solo, healers, especially wardens, can pretty much kill any other class of equal level. Sometimes up to five levels higher.

EQ2 needs to do what CoH has done and allow combat arts and spells to have two different uses. One in PVE and one in PVP.

7:48 PM  
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11:59 PM  

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